Vol. 13 · pages 921–925

888 DR. BABASAHEB AMBEDKAR : WRITINGS AND SPEECHES B. A. Examination, if he obtained 15 per cent of the total marks shall be deemed to have passed that examination; and suppose the Bihar University says that a candidate who has obtained 20 per cent of marks shall be deemed to have passed the B.A. Degree examination; and some other university fixes some other standard, then it would be quite a chaotic condition, and the expression that is usually used, that the candidate should be a graduate, I think, would be meaningless. Similarly, there are certain research insti tutes, on the results of which so many activities of the Central and Provincial Governments depend. Obviously you cannot permit the results of these technical and scientific institutes to deteriorate from the normal standard and yet allow them to be recognised either for the central purposes, for all-India purposes or the purposes of the State. Consequently, apart from the question of financial aid, it is absolutely essential, both in the interest of the centre as well as in the interests of the Provinces that the standards ought to be maintained on an allIndia basis. That is the purpose of this entry and in my judgment it is a very important and salutary provision, in view of the fact that there are many provinces who are in a hurry to establish research institutes or establish universities or lightly to lower their standards in order to give the impression to the world at large that they are producing much better results than they did before. Dr. P. S. Deshmukh : Is it the government’s intention to fix the percentages and marks for passes ? The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : They may do so. It is up to government to maintain the standard by any means which they think proper. I can not say what a government may do. [Amendment moved by Shri B. K. Das were withdrawn. Dr. Ambedkar’s motion was adopted, Entry 57-A was added to the union List.] ENTRY 58 *The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Sir, I move : “That for entry 58 of List I, the following entry be substituted : — ‘58. Union Public Services. All-India Services : Union Public Service Com mission.’ ” ***** †The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : With regard to the amendment of my Friend Dr. Punjabrao Deshmukh requiring the deletion of AllIndia services, it is not possible to accept that for the simple reason that *CAD, Vol. IX, 31st August 1949. p. 797. †Ibid., pp. 798-799.

889DRAFT CONSTITUTION heretofore the All-India services and the regulation thereof did not figure in the Government of India Act because that was a matter which was kept exclusively in the hands of the Secretary of State. The Secretary of Stale having disappeared, it is necessary to provide for the regulation of the all-India services, somewhere by some agency, in the Constitution and the most appropriate agency therefore is the Centre. List I deals with matters which are within the purview of the Centre. The natural place for All-India services is therefore in list I. That is one argument. The second argument is this that there are already two sorts of AllIndia services at present in existence. There are the remnants of the old I.C.S. still continuing lo serve the Government of India. Secondly, there have been in stituted during the course of the last two years what are called the All-India Administrative Service and the All-India Police Service. Whether the Centre continue lo recruit civil servants on the basis of the All-India administrative Service or the All-India Police Service is a matter which has to be determined in the course of a subsequent article with which we will be concerned. But there is no doubt about it that these services have been brought into existence with the consent of the Provinces. Secondly, they being there, it is necessary to make provision for their regulation. And I submit that the Union List is the proper list where this provision can be made. With regard to my Friend Mr. Kamath’s suggestion that the Joint Commission should be mentioned in this entry, my submission is that on a deeper consideration that would create complications. The Joint Com mission, so far as its constitution, the appointment of its members and their removal are concerned—and only in these three respects—is an All-India subject, and provision for these three matters is already made in article 284. In all other respects it is really a State Public Service Commission: say, for instance, for the purpose of excluding certain services or consulting them in certain matters, it will still be a State Public Service Commission. And it is not desirable to oust the jurisdiction of the Slates in these matters as would be the consequence if the Joint Commis sion was also mentioned in entry 58. It is for that purpose that I object to Mr. Kamath’s proposal. Shri H. V. Kamath : May I know if this will go lo the Concurrent List ? The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : No. Shri H. V. Kamath : Where will it go ? The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : It can be the Centre only in certain respects : for instance, if the States jointly say that a Joint Public

890 DR. BABASAHEB AMBEDKAR : WRITINGS AND SPEECHES Service Commission should be constituted, then as a result of the reso lution the Centre gets jurisdiction and not otherwise. In all fundamental matters, it is distributively, if I may say so, a State Public Service Commission. Dr. P. S. Deshmukh : I beg leave to withdraw my amendment. (The amendment was, by leave of the Assembly, withdrawn.) Mr. President : I shall put Mr. Kamath’s amendment to vote. [It was withdrawn. Dr. Ambedkar ‘s amendment was carried. Entry 58, as amended, was added to the Union List.] ENTRY 58-A *The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I move : “That after entry 58 of List I, the following entry be inserted : ‘58-A. Union pensions, that is to say, pensions payable by the Government of India or cut of the Consolidated Fund of India’.” This entry did not exist in the draft. We felt it necessary to have such an entry as a measure of caution. ***** The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I do not think that the amendment suggested by my Friend Dr. Deshmukh is any improvement or has any substantial difference from the amendment as I have moved. The difference that is sought to be made is this that there may be certain pensions which may be payable out of the Consolidated Fund of India, which means out of the proceeds of taxes. It may be perfectly possible for the Government of India to institute pensions which are of a contribu tory character in which case the burden may not be on the Consolidated Fund but on the person who has already contributed to a Fund. That is the distinction. And that is why the entry has been worded in the way I have worded it. Dr. P. S. Deshmukh : I would like to withdraw my amendment. (The amendment was, by leave of the Assembly, withdrawn.) [The motion of Dr. Ambedkar was adopted and Entry 58A wax added to the Union List.] ENTRY 60 †The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Sir, I move :— “That for entry 60 of List I, the following entry be substituted :— ‘60 Ancient and Historical Monuments and records declared by Parliament by law to be of national importance’.” *CAD, Vol. IX, 31st August 1949, pp. 799-801. †Ibid., p. 800.

891DRAFT CONSTITUTION The rest of the entry as it originally stood, namely, “archaeological sites and remains” is proposed to be transferred to the Concurrent List. Shri H. V. Kamath : ... I think Dr. Ambedkar has advanced no cogent reasons for changing the language of article 39 which is sought to be embodied now in this entry. I therefore move amendment No. 206 and commend it to the House for its acceptance. Mr. President : Would you like to say anything on amendment No. 206 ? The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : No Sir, it is quite unnecessary to say anything on this subject. Mr. President : Then I will put the amendment moved by Mr. Kamath to vole [The amendment was negatived. The motion of Dr. Ambedkar was adopted and Entry 60, as amended, was added to the Union List] Prof. Shibban Lal Saksena : Sir, may I be permitted to move my amendments ? Mr. President : You were not here when I called them out. I am sorry it is too late now. Prof. Shibban Lal Saksena : They are very important amendments, Sir, and I think they are independent also. The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : You have no equity in your favour. ***** ENTRY 61 *Mr. President : Let me finish the List and then we shall see. Now, entry No. 61. There is an amendment in the Printed List, of which notice is given by Dr. Ambedkar. No. 3548. The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Sir, I am not moving that. Mr. President : Then there are two amendments in the name of Mr. Santhanam. The Honourable Shri K. Santhanam : I am not moving them. Mr. President : Then I put Entry No. 61 to vote. (Entry 61 was added to the Union List.) *CAD, Vol. IX, 31st August 1949, p. 802.

892 DR. BABASAHEB AMBEDKAR : WRITINGS AND SPEECHES ENTRY 61-A The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I move : “That after entry 61 of List I, the following entry he inserted :— ‘61-A. Establishment of standards of quality for goods to be exported across customs, frontier or transported from one Slate to another’.” We have already got entry 61 which deals with standard of weights and measures and it is felt that there ought to he a provision for establishment of standards of quality for goods. ***** †The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : Sir, the point raised by my Friend Dr. Deshmukh might well be raised when we discuss the entries in List II. They are matters within the jurisdiction of the States. We are dealing here only with List I, which is intended to circumscribe the power of the centre so as not to interfere with the internal affairs of the States. Consequently the entry has been worded in a very cautious manner. As my Friend will see, the entry speaks of standards of goods to be transported from one State to another. In regard to these it is not intendd to give the centre power to interfere with the administration of the States. If he wants to raise this question he may do so when we discuss the State List. ? Dr. P. S. Deshmukh : May I suggest that this entry might be held over and the Agricultural Ministry consulted before we finalise this List ? The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : When we come to List II, we can discuss the matter. Mr. President : I will put the amendments to vote. (The amendments of Dr. Deshmukh were negatived.) Mr. President : I shall now put the new entry 61-A to vote. (The motion of Dr. Ambedkar was put to vote.) ***** ‡Shri V. S. Sarwate : I would like to know from Dr. Ambedkar what the meaning of the term ‘exported across customs frontier’ is ? Mr. President : I am afraid the questions comes too late, after the voting has taken place. The Honourable Dr. B. R. Ambedkar : I will explain it to the honourable Member if he will come to me afterwards. Mr. President : The question has been put. The motion was adopted. Entry 61-A was added to the Union List. *CAD, Vol. IX, 31st August 1949, p.802. †Ibid., p. 803. ‡Ibid., p. 804.