Vol. 14, Part II · pages 296–300

1076 DR. BABASAHEB AMBEDKAR : WRITINGS AND SPEECHES Shri Tyagi: I am a widower and I have no interest either in marriage or divorce. The Minister of States, Transport and Railways (Shri Gopalaswami) : Who knows ? You may yet improve ! Sardar B. S. Man : Many who are widowers here want the divorce system to be there because they hope to find their deliverance through it. However, Mr. Tyagi is an exception. In spite of the fact that he is a widower he is against divorce, rather an unusual phenomenon. Sardar Sochet Singh (P.E.P.S.U.): He may be interested in divorce in his neighbour’s house. Sardar B. S. Man : So, as I said, we were not consulted. Although, political opinions are very divergent on the Sikh community, the present Government is not listening either to the Congress Sikh, the Akali Sikh or the independent Sikh, nor even the Ministerialist Sikh. It is surprising how the Government has come to the wonderful conclusion that the Sikh opinion has been sufficiently agitated and consulted. After my speech yesterday, certain friends came to me and told me “Mr. Man, it is all right. We admit that your customs are different and that you were not consulted sufficiently. But why can we not legislate for you ? Because all along you have been a Hindu and you were governed by Hindu law,” I shall come to that point of whether we have ever been governed by Hindu law, but as to the point whether we are Hindus, I should not like to repeat the argument here but I would like to mention something in that connection. I came across a pamphlet yesterday wherein it is said that if you go to a village and tell a Sikh, “ You are a Hindu”, the answer will be not in words but a slap on your face. I will not—I dare not— use that argument here. Pandit Thakur Das Bhargava (Punjab): How are the Sikh agriculturists differently placed from the Hindu agriculturists of Punjab ? Sardar B. S. Man : I would have much liked to argue, and in fact I am actually basing all my arguments on that fact, that as an agriculturist I am in the company of Hindu agriculturists and the Musalman agriculturists. And my lawyer friend knows perfectly well that the Sikh agriculturist, along with the Hindu agriculturist and the Muslim agriculturist, is governed by a customary set of laws applicable uniformly to all. If I am using the word Sikh, it is due to the bane of this Bill. I would have liked to argue that the agriculturists of the Punjab

1077 DR. AMBEDKAR AND THE HINDU CODE BILL be absolved, but what shall I do when the Bill—in that respect a backward Bill, a communal Bill—legislates for Hindus, Sikhs, Jains etc. and talks in terms of communal groups and not in terms of secular groups ? Pandit Thakur Das Bhargava : Is it not a fact that the Hindu non-agriculturists living in the villages follow the same customs as the Hindu agriculturists ? Sardar B. S. Man : Yes. That is the beauty of our entire law in the Punjab. It is an advancement on other parts that we in the Punjab are governed by village communities and not by religious law. We are governed by land and we revolve round land laws, secular laws. Let me give a quotation to meet this interruption. I will quote from Rattigan’s Digest. My whole point is that, so far as this law is concerned in its application to Punjab, it is not reformative : it is not progressive because it is too conservative, because it is too orthodox ; it is retrograde because it is communal—our law in the Punjab has gone much farther at least so far as secularism is concerned. In our village communities we have been governed by the same set and same pattern of laws ; Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs, agriculturists and nonagriculturists, were attached to the land all these ages ; they imbibed the wisdom of the ages and the spirit of the times and throughout they were governed by one set of laws. But Dr. Ambedkar comes out one fine morning with this Hindu Code Bill—perhaps he is jealous of us—and says, “ I am going to cut across you and split you into two communal groups”. Either you be a Hindu or you be a Mussalman ! That is the effect of it. Shri Naziruddin Ahmad (West Bengal) : Rather, “give up all religions”! Sardar B. S. Man : Now what does Rattigan’s Digest say in this matter ? It says : “ It had long been felt by those best acquired with the habits and customs of the rural population that neither the Shara nor the Shastras really exercised any direct influence among them.” Then: “ The Hindu law extravagantly exalts the Brahman; it gives sacerdotal reasons for secular rules. In the Punjab, Hindus and Mussalmans converted from Hinduism may fear or feed the Brahman; but in civil affairs Punjab Customary Law ranks him with other men. It is essentially unsacerdotal, unsacramental, secular.”

1078 DR. BABASAHEB AMBEDKAR : WRITINGS AND SPEECHES Mr. Deputy Speaker : Is not the Shariat now applicable to the Punjab ? Sardar B. S. Man : I am splitting up the Punjab population into two distinct groups : one group comprises 95 per cent. of the population and the other remaining five per cent. The 95 per cent., and in fact even more, live in the villages and is attached to the land....... Mr. Deputy Speaker : Was not Shariat passed in undivided India ? Sardar B. S. Man : I shall come to the Punjab laws. There the custom is the primary rule of decision to the exclusion of Shariat as well as the Hindu Law, Dr. Ambedkar : That has been overruled by the Shariat law. Sardar B. S. Man : Shariat will fill in the gap when there is no customary law prevalent. It is quite distinct. I must refer to that later since I do not want my argument interrupted now. We have legislation— the Punjab Laws Act of 1872, clause 5—where it is distinctly laid down that in Punjab the first rule of decision will be the customary law and where there is no custom and a gap arises only then the Hindu law or the Shariat law will come in. Shri R. C. Upadhyaya (Rajasthan) : Are the customs reduced to writing ? Sardar B. S. Man : Not only, reduced to writing but compiled, listened to and decided—not for ten or fifteen years but for ages. An Hon. Member : Is not your custom the same as Hindu custom ? Sardar B. S. Man : What innocence ! If I were to prove to my friend here that my custom is entirely and fundamentally different from Hindu law, will he be prepared to make an exception ? Pandit Thakur Das Bhargava : If a custom is reasonable. Dr. Ambedkar is bound to accept it ( Interruption). Sardar B. S. Man : The interruptions are many. Interruptor says that if I convince him he is bound to accept it. I do not know whether I can convince a person who is not willing to be convinced : Dr. Ambedkar says, even if he is convinced he will not accept it. Now, let me give a quotation from Mayne’s Hindu Law ; it has held the field for a fairly long time and is a fairly authoritative commentary. It says: “As regards the Village Communities, the Punjab and the adjoining districts are the region in which alone they flourish in their primitive rigour. This is the tract which the Aryans must have

1079 DR. AMBEDKAR AND THE HINDU CODE BILL first traversed on entering India. Yet it seems to have been there that Brahmanism most completely failed to take root ….. and the religious element has never entered into their secular law: ” If I have enjoyed emancipation from Manu for so long a time, will it not be a tyranny of the times if I have to submit now to a modern Manu ? If I have not been governed by Brahmanical rule and I have had secular law for a long time in Punjab, if I have not accepted Manu’s religion, then let me assure the House that Punjab is not going to accept Ambedkarian religion henceforward, (interruption ). Let me give credit to Manu that at least he was original in many respects, but my modern Manu—oh, what a fall has he had ! He is neither original nor progressive. ( Interruption ). You ask who is the modern Manu ? Well, I need not say. Dr. Ambedkar : I am not a modern Manu. Sardar B. S. Man : In Punjab we do not recognise communal groupst and the application of this law will, for the first time introduce the communal element there. I shall read to you from Mayne’s Hindu Law, 9th Edition, Page 48, where it is said: “ The special interest of Punjab Customs arises from the fact that Brahmanism seems never to have succeeded in the Punjab. Accordingly, when we find a particular usage common to the Punjab and to Sanskrit law, we may infer that there is nothing necessarily Brahmanical in its origin. The Brahmans are not, in the Punjab, the depositaries of Customary law. To ascertain it, we must go to the Jirga, or Tribal Council, if there be one, or to the elders of the tribe. Shri R. K. Chaudhari (Assam) : I am sorry to interrupt, but let us come straight to the point. Does the Hon. Member want monogamy or not ? That is the question. Shri Tyagi: Why beat about the bush ? Sardar B. S. Man : A false sense of security is being created in the House through the Press that Government want to proceed with only marriage and divorce. Has Dr. Ambedkar declared here difinitely that he is leaving out the other portions and he is only concerned with marriage and divorce ? I am discussing the applicability of this Code in its entirety. I proceed on the assumption that the other portions are not going to be dropped. I caution my friends. Once Government lull you into a sense of indifference and false feeling of security, they will proceed with the other portions.

1080 DR. BABASAHEB AMBEDKAR : WRITINGS AND SPEECHES Shri R. K. Chaudhari: Please answer my question. According to the customary law monogamy is allowed in Punjab. Are you in favour of continuing the monogamy law ? Sardar B. S. Man : I shall discuss that threadbare, law by law. Mr. Deputy Speaker : We are not going to take up other matters. I think, it was made suficiently clear by the Hon. the Prime Minister who stated that they would proceed only with marriage and divorce. If this is accepted, I hope the hon. Member will resume his seat. Sardar Hukam Singh (Punjab): If this clause is accepted at this stage, would it be again taken into consideration when the other Chapters come up ? Once it is made applicable, certainly the whole thing has to be thrashed out at this stage. Mr. Deputy Speaker: If the Bill is confined to marriage and divorce and the other parts are brought in by a separate Bill, does the Hon. Member think that this clause will apply to everyone ? Shrimati Durgabai (Madras): What is the basis for the Hon. Member’s statement that the most important Chapters relating to inheritance will be dropped ? What is the source of his information ? Sardar B. S. Man : The hon. lady Member comes to my rescue for the first time. It is exactly because the other portions have not been dropped, I say that I am perfectly entitled to discuss the whole body of it. Shri Bharati (Madras): The Prime Minister and the Law Minister have already stated that due to factors of time etc. it is more than unlikely that the other Chapters would be taken up. Although it may not be a categorical assurance, for all practical purposes we may take it as the official decision. If we take the practical aspects of the matter, in all probability, I may even say 99 per cent. the other Chapters would not be taken up during the current session. It is just possible that we may take them up during February or March next, but during the current session it is absolutely impossible to take up other Chapters. It will be great fortune if we finish Chapter II. Therefore, I would request other members to co-operate. At least, let us pass this portion. I think it will be in the interests of the discussion if Dr. Ambedkar makes some kind of statement and gives, if not a categorical assurance at least some indication, that only the provisions relating to marriage and divorce would be passed during the current session. Pandit M. B. Bhargava (Ajmer): Has the hon. Member been briefed by the Government of India to take up this position ?